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Re: [media] Moving forward with captions / subtitles

From: Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2010 22:29:48 +1100
Message-ID: <2c0e02831002150329x694257a6k2659ae79baa81494@mail.gmail.com>
To: Philip Jägenstedt <philipj@opera.com>
Cc: Eric Carlson <eric.carlson@apple.com>, HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Philip Jägenstedt <philipj@opera.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Feb 2010 14:41:53 +0800, Silvia Pfeiffer
> <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> lang="" is already inherited,
>>
>> Where from? I am confused.
>
> The language of a node in HTML depends on the node itself and all ancestor
> nodes. [1] In other words lang="" is inherited and I'm saying that if one
> motivation for grouping is to save typing then we can let role="" be
> inherited in the same way.

Actually, I have wondered about @lang before and just forgotten about
it. I don't think we can use the normal @lang attribute anyway, since
it specifies the "primary language for the element's contents". In our
case, we actually want it to specify the language of the resource in
@src. So, in other such elements it was called @hreflang. We probably
need to come up with something like this, too.

About inheritance of the value: I agree that that's what is expected
from the top-level element.


> We've agreed on the basics for a long time, this is all about finding the
> appropriate markup/structure to express it, isn't it? I find my
> <track><source> suggestion confusing because <track> actually contains many
> tracks. Also, it makes the nesting mandatory, as <source> cannot be given as
> a direct child to <audio>/<video> as that would conflict with the resource
> selection algorithm. <trackgroup><track> is intended to address both of
> these problems.

Oh, I didn't believe we would use <source> as the top-level, but it
would continue to be track.

So, it would be either:

<track role="SUB">
  <source src="subtitles.en.srt" lang="en">
  <source src="subtitles.sv.srt" lang="sv">
  <source src="subtitles.fr.srt" lang="fr">
  <source src="subtitles.zh.srt" lang="zh">
</track>
<track role="captions">
  <source src="captions.en.srt" lang="en">
  <source src="captions.sv.srt" lang="sv">
  <source src="captions.fr.srt" lang="fr">
  <source src="captions.zh.srt" lang="zh">
</track>

when we want just one of the sources be chosen as the subtitle track.

Or it would be:

<track src="caption.en.srt" lang="en" role="CC">
<track src="subtitles.sv.srt" lang="sv" role="SUB">
<track src="subtitles.fr.srt" lang="fr" role="SUB">
<track src="subtitles.zh.srt" lang="zh" role="SUB">

if they were all independent and possible to be activated in parallel,
just like the grouped tracks above can be active in parallel.

I do like the re-use of <source> since it overlaps with so many
elements with the existing <source> element - all we need to do is add
a @srclang attribute (or something similar).

Alternatively, the language could of course always be stuck into the
@media element with other media queries. However, I'm increasingly
wondering if the @media element is not just an framework for
introducing new attributes without making them explicit. But that's
another discussion altogether.

Regards,
Silvia.
Received on Monday, 15 February 2010 11:30:41 GMT

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