W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-html-a11y@w3.org > April 2010

RE: CFC re ISSUE-31 Missing Alt

From: Sean Hayes <Sean.Hayes@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2010 13:17:40 +0000
To: David Singer <singer@apple.com>, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>
CC: "Gregory J. Rosmaita" <oedipus@hicom.net>, HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
Message-ID: <8DEFC0D8B72E054E97DC307774FE4B911A519C81@DB3EX14MBXC315.europe.corp.microsoft.com>
I think Gregory's proposed text; while valid, is more of an ATAG issue than an HTML one.  What I think we need to debate is if there is any normative remedial action we want to propose for an HTML5 UA to make if it gets an image where the author has explicitly said I'm not going to tell you what this image is, or why I included it.  

I'm not sure that there is, given that the suggested techniques are heuristic, fragile, and very likely to change over time. It's something we might want to bring up with the UAAG folks though.  It could be an informative note, but even that may encourage authors to think that these techniques are more robust than they really are.

This is slightly different than allowing an attribute for the author to make the statement in the first place, which we seem to have come to some consensus on. 

-----Original Message-----
From: public-html-a11y-request@w3.org [mailto:public-html-a11y-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of David Singer
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 3:00 AM
To: Laura Carlson
Cc: Gregory J. Rosmaita; HTML Accessibility Task Force
Subject: Re: CFC re ISSUE-31 Missing Alt

'a missing tag' is ambiguous (and 'a missing tag must be generated' could be seen as a contradiction...)

a tag stating that 'alt' is known to be missing, perhaps?

'which can then be...' appears to be connected to the authoring tool, rather than this new tag

overall:
if an authoring tool prompts an author for alt text and the author explicitly refuses to supply it, then a tag stating that 'alt' is missing MUST be auto-generated by the authoring tool; the presence of this tag can then be used to trigger a retrieval process such as that outlined in the emails on RDFPic [1] and the RDF and Photos W3C Note [2]

I'm not at all sure I agree with this approach, but we may as well be clear about what we are debating!

On Apr 28, 2010, at 16:51 , Laura Carlson wrote:

> Hi Gregory,
> 
>> my 2 cents (american) on an auto-generated authoring-tool inserted 
>> missing alt tag:
>> 
>> if an authoring tool prompts an author for alt text and the author 
>> explicitly refuses, then a missing tag MUST be auto-generated by the 
>> authoring tool, which can then be used to trigger a retrieval process 
>> such as that i outlined in my post on RDFPic [1] and the RDF and 
>> Photos W3C Note [2]
> 
> Thank you very much for this. I added a section on the Change Proposal 
> for metadata using your text as a start.
> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/User:Lcarlson/ImgElement#Metadata
> 
> Thoughts everyone? Ideas for improvement? Can anyone not live with this?
> 
> Best Regards,
> Laura
> 
> --
> Laura L. Carlson
> 

David Singer
Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.
Received on Thursday, 29 April 2010 13:18:28 GMT

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.2.0+W3C-0.50 : Friday, 27 April 2012 04:42:08 GMT