See also: IRC log
<scribe> scribe: DanC
PROPOSED: to accept http://www.w3.org/2007/07/18-grddl-wg-minutes.html as a true record
<HarryH> I'm going to dial back in
scribe volunteer for 8 Aug?
john-l: I volunteer to scribe 8 Aug
RESOLUTION: to accept http://www.w3.org/2007/07/18-grddl-wg-minutes.html as a true record
RESOLUTION: to meet again 8 Aug, john-l to scribe
HH: comments from the schema WG show surprise/confusion that we require schemas at the namespace document... discussion of whether schemas from other parties are 3rd-party info or a faithful rendition
HH: changes start with [For example, ...
<chimezie> I don't understand those changes
chimezie: "Furthermore, in
addition to being GRDDL-aware, an agent may feature optional
capabilities such as allowing a schema and an associated
transformation" doesnt' make sense to me...
... is the "associated transformations" a GRDDL mechanism?
HH: consider a schema with a
transformation link, where the GRDDL-aware agent finds the
schema by way of a parameter
... so the result is not a faithful rendition
JJC: I like the way the text
separates what an agent could do from the GRDDL part...
... for example, my code might do RDFa at user option, regardless of GRDDL mechanisms
... or I might support "Read this document with this schema"
DanC: I'd prefer not to mention anything beyond GRDDL, but I can live with what's there, given "in addition to being GRDDL-aware..."
Chime: why not talk about random other features... rendering SVG?
DanC: because reviewers haven't asked ---
JJC: and because those other features are not small code changes
<chimezie> i have specific text suggestion as an alternative
danja: re "may not be a faithful rendition" ... hmm... maybe "may or may not..."
DanC: that change doesn't seem worth another round-trip thru the XQuery WG
<chimezie> Furthermore, in addition to being GRDDL-aware, an agent may feature optional capabilities such as
<chimezie> locating a schema via mechanisms defined in the W3C XML Schema specification [XMLSCHEMA]. Schemas identified
<chimezie> this way can become proxies for namespace documents that would normally be identified by GRDDL [#ns-bind] and the results of applying such a transformation may not be a faithful rendition.]
<danja> if there's a noticeable cost to cycling this through the the xsl wg, the current wording seems good enough
jjc: this clarifies "and an associated transformation"?
<jjc> Are the results still going to be a
<jjc> Faithful Rendition of the original XML document? If the GRDDL-aware
<jjc> agent is permitted to apply transformations that the GRDDL spec cannot
<jjc> ensure were endorsed by the XML document author, then the GRDDL spec
<jjc> cannot ensure that the RDF results do represent a Faithful Rendition.
HH: note I added "... XSLT 1.0" to test notes
<scribe> ACTION: chimezie to choose some text based on http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-comments/2007JulSep/0041.html , updated editors draft, and notify the commentors (XQuery WG) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] danja and john-l to test and see if any XSLT is mature enough to add to ATOM namespace doc and has proper licensing (W3C Software license), as well as canvass all candidate XSLT authors for their opinion on ATOM/RSS 1.0 namespace. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<DanC_> (oops; I split the agenda too much)
HH: how to make it so anybody can answer, Dan?
DanC: write to sysreq or webreq,
copy me. somebody will do some SQL magic
... perhaps sync with Ivan Herman
<scribe> ACTION: HarryH to make Questionnaire as regards microformat XSLTs and e-mail swig list. [DONE] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<HarryH> ACTION: HarryH to ask W3C Sysadmins to make survey world-usable, co-ordinating with Ivan. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
DanC: yes... "Link to GRDDL from HTML and RDF validators?" is an idea from way back... not sure I have energy these days...
Harry: who is responsible for the
W3C RDF validation service? a WG?
... the W3C systems team?
DanC: yes, systems team... the buck tends to not stop anywhere in particular, though. jjc is quite influential
jjc: I tend to push web issues toward EricP, and just do RDF related stuff
DanC: Olivier T. is influential in the HTML validation service
HarryH: how does a WG ask for
... the CG?
DanC: yes, the CG, Ivan H. as activity lead... and yes, the w3c comm team is relevant
<HarryH> ACTION: HarryH to e-mail about updating HTML and RDF to work with a properly working GRDDL Service in concert with Press Release. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<danja> mail re. DC has gone to list (twice)
danja: some progress on my action...
<scribe> ACTION: IanD and Danja to e-mail maintainer of Dublin Core Metadata Profile to upgrade to GRDDL. [DONE] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
danja: there isn't an agreed mapping to the new DC model
DanC: there's an existing DCMI REC, with examples; I used those examples as test cases and implemented a transformation [and told them so]... if they're not willing to support that because they're playing with new designs, I'm disappointed.
HH: did they have some particular issue with Dan's transformation?
danja: there's no mention of it in this exchange
(oops; I haven't cited my work from http://esw.w3.org/topic/CustomRdfDialects )
danja: I'm ok with following up on the request to install Dan's transformation
<HarryH> ACTION: Danja to e-mail DC back mentioning that DanC has already made transformation to a stable version of their spec, and mention that it would be great to mention RDF and Dublin Core in press release for GRDDL. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<DanC_> (I'm looking for a message where I specifically pointed out the test-driven work I did on dc-extract.xsl , using examples in their spec as test cases)
HH: a member of the XHTML 2 WG responded regarding head/@profile, saying the functionality has a different syntax now
<myakura> please note that message was my personal thought.
<myakura> xhtml2 wg has that issue on our tc agenda, but hasn't talked about that yet.
HH: I think they should also support the head/@profile syntax
chime: hmm... so do I... I wonder about tactics...
DanC: the way to get a change to the XHTML 2 spec is to write a comment to their comments list
<HarryH> ACTION: Chime to comment to XHTML2 comment list about preserving head/@profile re GRDDL and backwards-compatibility. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
ah... good to know, myakura
HarryH: I wrote to Dave Beckett and Ryan king; no response so far
<myakura> (we were supposed to talke about that at today's tc, which was unfortunately postponed.)
discussion of testamonials in progress in some member orgs...
<scribe> ACTION: HarryH to ask David Beckett to ask AC rep to a testimonial. [DONE] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<scribe> ACTION: HarryH to ask RyanKing for Testimonial about microformats and GRDDL [DONE] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<scribe> ACTION: rreck to ask Ken and Encyl. Brit. for testimonials [CONTINUES] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/01-grddl-wg-irc]
<HarryH> Adjourn Meeting
DanC: SW client lib supports GRDDL+SPARQL; we could say a bit about that in the implementation report.
<danja> SW Client Lib. algorithm: http://sites.wiwiss.fu-berlin.de/suhl/bizer/ng4j/semwebclient/#how
<DanC_> tx for pointer, danja