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Re: charter all set now?

From: Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 15:48:29 +0200
Message-ID: <527405415.20070704154829@w3.org>
To: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
Cc: boyerj@ca.ibm.com, public-forms@w3.org

On Wednesday, July 4, 2007, 12:08:04 AM, T.V wrote:

TVR> Note that in today's browsers, there is a significant difference
TVR> between "extension" and "plugin". Specifically, XForms for
TVR> Firefox is an extension, *not* a plugin 

Yes, thats true and should be noted. An extension is closer to native support than a plugin.

TVR> Chris Lilley writes:

 >> On Wednesday, June 27, 2007, 8:44:10 PM, John wrote:

 >> JB> There is only one diff-marked section that jumped out as really
 >> JB> different from what the Forms WG otherwise understands as its
 >> JB> mission, as expressed in charter mission statement. 
 >> JB>  
 >> JB> The mission statement seems to more accurately reflect our
 >> JB> understanding, which is that it is the Forms WG mission to
 >> JB> *develop* specifications that cover forms on the Web. 
 >> JB>  
 >> JB> Yet the description of the dependency between the Forms WG and the
 >> JB> HTML WG says:
 >> JB>  
 >> JB> "The Forms WG will work with the HTML WG to ensure that XForms
 >> JB> Transitional processors will accept the HTML Forms developed by
 >> JB> the HTML Working Group."
 >> JB>  
 >> JB> The last part 'developed by the HTML working group' is
 >> JB> problematic because it is the mission of the Forms WG to develop
 >> JB> forms on the web, accounting via the joint task force for the
 >> JB> forms requirements foreseen by the HTML WG.   
 >> JB>  
 >> JB> Despite this one case, I would say that my experience so far with
 >> JB> the HTML WG suggests that their own opinions about how forms for
 >> JB> the web are to be developed stems mostly from the fact that they
 >> JB> do not feel bound by any statements expressed in a charter other
 >> JB> than their own, despite the fact that you originally wrote them
 >> JB> together.  They have expressed this directly, so this means that
 >> JB> any statements of clarification would need to appear in both
 >> JB> charters, not just the forms charter.

 >> The html charter says

 >>   The HTML WG and the Forms Working Group will work together in this
 >>   Task Force to ensure that the new HTML forms and the new XForms
 >>   Transitional have architectural consistency and that document
 >>   authors can transition between them

 >> so it seems that the existing charter already covers this. I discussed
 >> this with the comm team and they said that the existing language
 >> appeared to cover it.

 >> JB> For example, there is a lot of confusion about the meaning of
 >> JB> 'architectural consistency' and when I point to the key examples
 >> JB> you give in the Forms WG charter, such as the expectation of
 >> JB> "conversion from tag soup to *equivalent* XHTML serialization" or
 >> JB> "following design principles such as separation of presentation
 >> JB> from content", the response I get is that these are expressed in
 >> JB> the forms charter so they are not binding on the HTML WG. 

 >> JB> That sounds an awful lot like the HTML WG feels it is the HTML
 >> JB> WG's mission to develop specifications that cover forms on the
 >> JB> web, which of course undercuts the Forms WG mission and
 >> JB> discourages motivation for Forms WG members to participate in any
 >> JB> kind of joint task force (despite my best efforts to encourage otherwise).

 >> JB> I think it would be fair to rephrase "but relatively little
 >> JB> traction in the mainstream, browser sector" to something more
 >> JB> accurate, such as "despite having only indirect support from
 >> JB> features available in modern web browsers." 

 >> We agree with that and have added similar wording (explicit mention of
 >> plugins).

 >> -- 
 >>  Chris Lilley                    mailto:chris@w3.org
 >>  Interaction Domain Leader
 >>  Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
 >>  W3C Graphics Activity Lead
 >>  Co-Chair, W3C Hypertext CG

 Chris Lilley                    mailto:chris@w3.org
 Interaction Domain Leader
 Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
 W3C Graphics Activity Lead
 Co-Chair, W3C Hypertext CG
Received on Wednesday, 4 July 2007 13:49:07 UTC

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