W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-egov-ig@w3.org > October 2012

2012-10-19 Minutes

From: Phil Archer <phila@w3.org>
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:56:40 +0100
Message-ID: <50818648.7000903@w3.org>
To: "eGov IG (Public)" <public-egov-ig@w3.org>
Minutes from today's productive call are at 
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/19-egov-minutes.html (and linked from the wiki).

For those that prefer it (like me), the text version is below.

                           eGov Interest Group

19 Oct 2012



    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2012/10/19-egov-irc


           Sandro, PhilA, +1.508.333.aaaa, +1.202.684.aabb,
           GannonDick, Jeanne, bhyland, +1.413.652.aacc,
           DeirdreLee, +1.843.682.aaee, +1.703.281.aaff,
           olyerickson, bdhandspicker, DanielBennett, Owen,
           BrandNieman, [IPcaller]

           Jeanne Holm

           olyerickson, PhilA


      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]Caller ID-ing
          2. [6]Reminder of Agenda:
          3. [7]Social Media in Taiwan
          4. [8]Social Media at Nasa
          5. [9]Future Topics
          6. [10][what is the topic?]
          7. [11]Wrapup
          8. [12]Future Topics
          9. [13]Community Directory

Caller ID-ing

Reminder of Agenda: [14]http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Main_Page

      [14] http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/Main_Page

Social Media in Taiwan

    Apologies from TH Schee (at hospital)

    Jeanne_: We'll postpone his preso

    ideas for Schee to communicate?

    PhilA: Best is schedule another time

    * play it by ear

Social Media at Nasa

    Jeanne_: Link in wiki


    <PhilA> Draft summary of the various presentations we've heard
    about social media use around the world, currently in a Word
    doc at

      [16] http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/images/7/73/W3C_eGov_Social_Media.doc

    Wanted to communicate the excitement about what NASA is doing

    Jeanne_: (garbled)

    <bhyland> Could the IPcall please mute their line  we're
    hearing a lot of background noise from you

    * Slide 2: Generational differences in sharing

    * Slide 3: Trust & Reciprocity

    <sandro> bhyland, I'm afraid the noise is at Jeanne's location

    <bhyland> oh.

    <bhyland> better

    * using social media to create a relationship with people who
    care about NASA

    * NASA unique as an agency

    * Slide 4: The Learning Journey

    * Slide 5: Example from NASA portal: "the usual stuff..."

    * Alide 6: NASA internal collaboration links

    * Slide 7: Using semantic technologies to find NASA experts
    (hmmm, way cool)

    ** using social media to both reach OUT and to reach IN

    * But that wasn't seen as enough based on the challenge given
    to NASA by the president

    * a different kind of engagement is required (paradigm shift

    * Slide 8: Paradigm Shift/competive edge

    Slide 11: Facebook utilization

    * implementation of various surveys using FB as a platform

    * be where they are

    * NASA has lots of pages: a page for each mission

    * NASA wants to be flexible based on what people want/what
    they're interest in

    * Personality of page needs to reflect the people who
    congregate there

    Took successes from FB to other platforms: YouTube

    Slide 12: iTunes deployment (podcasts)

    Jeanne_: (wicked garbled)

    Slide 14: First to tweet from space

    * Lots of astronauts on Twitter

    Slide 15: Second Life

    * engagement of students, etc in various activities

    * key opportunity is to learn what communication is working and
    what isn't

    * find out what people don't understand

    Slide 17: Center for Global Change

    * learned that many people don't understasnd the issues around
    global warming

    * 2nd life used to walk avatar through the problem

    * ie use of visualization through s.m. platforms to explain

    Slide 19: Usage of crowdsourcing

    * utilization of game technologiu

    <PhilA> serious games... now there's a meme...

    Slide 20: View into virtual view of surface of Mars

    * allows people to explore, engage as the robot is engaging

    * NASA wanted to inspire in ways that traditional modes of
    engagement wouldn't

    Some bumps along the way

    Very cost effective

    Questions for Jeanne_ ?

    PhilA: No one has the galleries et.al. of NASA

    * could anyone else do what NASA does?

    A: Other orgs may not have the followers, but

    principle of going to where the people are still holds

    * In the case of NASA, urgent to engage peopel the people are
    the stakeholders

    * NASA took some chances, some risks, but worth it to improve

    <PhilA> olyerickson: I had a question... The general concept of
    building social networks around agencies... NASA is unique,
    lots of people care about it

    <PhilA> olyerickson: but there are other parts of the US gov
    who are exploring other methods of reaching its followers

    <PhilA> olyerickson: For example, people are concerned about
    social services etc. i.e. there are others

    Jeanne_: Can't think of an agency that ISN'T using s.m. in some

    * example: CIA is focusing on improvement; recruiting people to
    "help out"

    * so even an agency that doesn't usually share is reaching out

    * another example: state department

    * concept: not trying to do everything, but focus with the
    group(s) you want to reach out to and be where they are

Future Topics

    Jeanne_: has been gathering potential speakers on social media

    ia.doc for summary

      [17] http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/images/7/73/W3C_eGov_Social_Media.doc

    Jeanne_: Wants our feedback on how to organize the above

    * We could come up with "best practices" etc

    PhilA: everything but a Recommendation(tm)

    Jeanne_: Most interesting thing: what objectives various
    different govts had in using social media

    * Presenters didn't intend their methods to be considered "best
    practices" but rather simple examples of methods

    Lessons summarized are important

    Q for group: Is this useful?

    <DanielBennett> queue

    <Jeanne_> Should add in the The interaction between government
    and the tool providers. Terms of service.

    <Jeanne_> DanielBennett: Legal identifiers, identity issues,
    licensing should all have a section addressed to it

    DanielBennett: WOuld liek to see more detail on legal et.al. on

    <Jeanne_> DanielBennett: What is the best way that protects
    citizens and government's role in use of social media.

    * e.g. who moderates, what are the issues

    DanielBennett: The point is, there are lots of issues; they
    need to be laid out

    * eg: accessibility

    <Jeanne_> DanielBennett: Accessibility issues, use, copyrights,
    privacy of citizen information all needs to be understood
    before "just standing up" a social media capability.

    * a whole gamet that protects citizens, ensures govt abides by
    its laws, etc

    <Owen> Here's a plan for use of social media by educational
    institutions: [18]http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/GSMwStyle.xml

      [18] http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/GSMwStyle.xml

    <DanielBennett> willing to help build out the issues i was

    <Jeanne_> Note that Rachel Flagg's presentation discussed some
    of this for the US government: [19]http://www.howto.gov/tos

      [19] http://www.howto.gov/tos

    <PhilA> olyerickson: On a slightly different point... we're
    doing some work with NIST on first responders/leveraging social

    <Jeanne_> olyerickson: We are doing work on social networks and
    first responders

    <PhilA> olyerickson: the question comes up around when you
    create a community cf. when you leverage an existing one

    <Owen> I will render Jeanne's proposed objectives in StratML

    <PhilA> olyerickson: NASA has its own platform but you're also
    using other people's

    <Jeanne_> Thanks Owen! You may want to wait until I get one
    more draft out

    <PhilA> olyerickson: You said you have multiple FB pages to
    meet different interests

    <PhilA> olyerickson: You need to go to where people are... that
    multi-modal approach is more of a methodology

    <PhilA> Jeanne_: (breaking up a little)

    Jeanne_: At W3C Accessibility Conference

    Using accessibility as an example

    <PhilA> Jeanne_: Only 40% of the US population has meaningful
    access to the internet

    "Don't forget traditional ways to engage the public"

    <PhilA> Jeanne_: So social media isn't everything. Still need
    traditional methods - town hall meetings, snail mail etc

    * trad. media provides important way to extend the conversation
    from social media

    * conversation begins in social media and can go where it needs

    <GannonDick> thinks, the Flat Earth shouldn't be abandoned just

    <DanielBennett> happy to help add that new section

    <PhilA> +1 to a Google doc for a collaborative space

    <DanielBennett> re: government rules meet social media

    <PhilA> or the wiki

[what is the topic?]

    Jeanne_: Use of social media to ensure people are being heard

    * effectiveness and approriateness of mobile devices

    <DanielBennett> is there a subcommittee that is overseeing the
    editing of the social media "note"?

    * use of structured methods

    Summary: "Tools and Methods" were all over the place

    Scribe's note: We're still talking about the eGov Social Media
    "Summary Document"

    Jeanne_: Will add e.g. issues suggested by DanielBennett
    ... We've had O(dozen) presentations over last 3 mos

    * a huge amount of material

    * but only a small sampling

    Next steps:

    * Community Directory

    * Stakeholder engagement

    * Feedback Loops

    * <insert Page 3 "Key Findings" bullets here>

    Jeanne_: Those are *her* key findings, what did others hear?

    * PhilA: Thanks Jeanne_ a lot of hard work to go through and

    * hearing the different perspectives e.g. Oman has been

    * Can eGov group take this on and "knock it into shapre"

    * big but interesting task for group to take it on

    <DanielBennett> We should have a committee that meets in
    addition to this main meeting to build this document

    Jeanne_: When we re-formed group, we heard "something" should
    be produced

    * it is an IG not a WG, there are limits

    <DanielBennett> I helped do this with the past group note

    * but this document and a COmmunity Directory are two things
    that CAN be done

    +1 to what we were hoping for

    +1 to helping in a large or small way ;)

    <Owen> Jeanne's draft objectives are now available in
    StratMLformat at [20]http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/OSMG.xml

      [20] http://xml.gov/stratml/carmel/OSMG.xml

    <Jeanne_> Thanks Owen

    Q: Can this doc be W3C wikified in a W3C acceptable way?

    <Jeanne_> DanielBennett: Created a document before with lead
    people for each section, and separate meetings that helped to
    work the editorial process

    Not sure what the work product DanielBennett is referring to
    might be

    <Owen> I have tried to engage wiki vendors in incorporating the
    StratML standard into their services ... thus far without
    discernable results

    * specifics I mean

    Q: What is "the format" A "Group Note?"


    DanielBennett: Time constraints need to not be "loosey-goosey"

    +1 to helping (assuming I understand what I'm helping on)

    <GannonDick> Owen, maybe I could help with a Strat

    <GannonDick> ml to

    <GannonDick> oo which exports

    <DeirdreLee> +1 for information and data sharing section

    <GannonDick> media wiki

    Q: Will this be W3C hosted []yes []no

    <PhilA> Let me or Sandro know if and when you want to book a
    slot on the Zakim bridge

    Q: Will this be in wiki format []yes []no

    <PhilA> Yes, olyerickson, it will be W3C hosted

    Q: Will this be public from the start []yes []no

    <Jeanne_> It is public right now.

    <Owen> I will contribute in any way that I can, both in format
    and substance

    DeirdreLee: Will contribute information & data sharing

    <Jeanne_> I would think we should keep it transparent, although
    as it moves through some iterations it make be in discussion.

    GannonDick: Can do StratML magic to it

    <Owen> Gannon, you are already referenced at

      [21] http://xml.gov/stratml/index.htm#Part3

    <Owen> Will look forward to seeing StratML wikified

    <DanielBennett> [22]http://www.w3.org/TR/gov-data/

      [22] http://www.w3.org/TR/gov-data/

    PhilA: Encourages us to not be scared

    Q: Does W3C process even apply (if this is not a
    Recommendation(tm) )

    sandro: Every contributor MUST be a member of the group and
    follows IP policies

    Jeanne_: Initiate group member list etc yada yada

    DanielBennett: The wiki platform does a great job

    <Jeanne_> yada yada = make sure people have agreed to W3C
    intellectual guidelines and policies

    * even "pencil and paper" (definition? ;) )

    PhilA: If tehre is something you need/want control over, DON'T
    contribute it...

    DanielBennett: If you contribute, your name will be listed (but
    not good for tenure... )

    Jeanne_: (garbled)


    <DanielBennett> yw

    Thanks all around

    Special thanks to DanielBennett ( Jeanne_ owes him a pint)

    <DanielBennett> excellent, thanks

Future Topics

    Trying to find someone with knowledge on interaction, policies,

Community Directory

    <PhilA> scribe: PhilA

    <bhyland> Please keep in mind that the GLD WG has a deliverable
    that is a community directory, see


    <Brand> Re I have tried to engage wiki vendors in incorporating
    the StratML standard into their services - I think we have gone
    beyond StratML with MindTouch TCS:

      [24] http://www.mindtouch.com/solutions/knowledge_base

    Jeanne_: I want to go haed and make the building of the
    directory as an asynchronous activity
    ... want to write a wiki page to set out what we should try and

    <bhyland> A working directory that will improve with iteration
    & input from the eGov IG is here, [25]http://dir.w3.org

      [25] http://dir.w3.org/

    Jeanne_: doesn't need to be a verbal discussion, just need to
    get on with it

    bdhandspicker: Doing is better than talking about it

    <bhyland> We're open to making it an Open Data directory ...

    <bdhandspicker> Clarification - precise quote from me:
    "Sometimes doing is better than talking something to death."

    Crossover directory [26]http://www.crossover-project.eu/

      [26] http://www.crossover-project.eu/

    <bhyland> ++1 to what PhilA is saying, it gardener is required
    to maintain a garden

    Jeanne_: Sounds good...

    bhyland: +1 to PhilA - it's hard to get this going. We have a
    directory built on W3C standards top to bottom. What we need is
    the input
    ... We need more data and maybe a better UI but we should
    combine our efforts and not dilute them

    <Brand> We are working on a directory of government "big data"
    sets and projects for Congress and the Federal Government:


    bhyland: We should be promoting things like the UK's ODI etc.
    through the directory
    ... I would be disappointed if there were multiple directories
    - we should have one good one.

    Jeanne_: And yes, in this case, more is not better
    ... I think it would be appropriate to include the topcs we're
    looking at. I'll look at the directory

    <bhyland> Caveat: Working code that has a few committed
    "gardeners" is critical to a community site.

    <Owen> If the directory complies with applicable standards for
    interoperability, does it matter whether there is one or many?

    bdhandspicker: I was just going to remind folks that not all
    gov data is open data
    ... But I'm sure that the directory could capture experts in
    data that isn't open

    <Owen> I'd like to post my own data for the directory(ies) on
    my own site.

    bhyland: Yes - just because you might come from a company that
    does OD, that doesn't mean you only do OD

    PhilA: I think that's one of the functions that the Directory
    has - it's all built on RDF and SPARQL

    ^^ for Owen

    Jeanne: The last thing to mention is ICEGOV in Albany. Both I
    and Tomas will be there

    PhilA: So will Crossover project btw

    Jeanne: Next project will be Open data. What I want to do is to
    put out a call for speakers in the next 2 months or so.
    Including private gov data etc.
    ... we'll be organising those sessions.
    ... I think the two time zone thing is working - we've had some
    good comments on that
    ... Thanks everyone for their contributions


    <bdhandspicker> I'll scribe next time.... reading the 101

    <bdhandspicker> bye

    <DanielBennett> same here. thanks.

    <Brand> Jeanne. Thanks, I have to go to another meeting - I
    posted my suggestions

    <DanielBennett> bye

    <Jeanne_> Thanks everyone!

    [End of minutes]


Phil Archer
W3C eGovernment

+44 (0)7887 767755
Received on Friday, 19 October 2012 16:57:09 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.1 : Tuesday, 6 January 2015 21:00:49 UTC