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Re: [i18n-discuss] The HTML q element can sometimes be useful. Discuss.

From: r12a via GitHub <sysbot+gh@w3.org>
Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2016 21:14:14 +0000
To: public-digipub-ig@w3.org
Message-ID: <issue_comment.created-215883523-1461964452-sysbot+gh@w3.org>
There seems to be an inclination to use the q element any place there 
are quotation marks. This is not my understanding of the intent of the
 usage described in the HTML5 spec, which says:

> The q element represents some phrasing content quoted from another 
> ...
> Content inside a q element must be quoted from another source, whose
 address, if it has one, may be cited in the cite attribute. The 
source may be fictional, as when quoting characters in a novel or 
> ...
>  The q element must not be used in place of quotation marks that do 
not represent quotes; for example, it is inappropriate to use the q 
element for marking up sarcastic statements. 

I think that part of the confusion in the discussion can be put down 
to the lack of precision in the way the words 'quotes', and 
'quotations' even, are used in English: meaning quoted from another 
source, meaning dialogues, meaning pull-quotes, or meaning anything 
else with quotation marks around it. Whereas Rebeca says that some 
languages such as Spanish make a linguistic distinction between 
quotations and dialogue, for example.

I think the HTML5 definition is fairly specific, and points away from 
use for dialogue ('quoted from another source'), and perhaps usefully 
so, since dialogue indeed entails a number of different features, not 
least including the need to bridge around the ',he said ' kind of 

So for the example about Attila the Hun above, i think that probably 
the bold-italic text, which represents text lifted from the 
translation by R C Blockley of Priscus' writings should be enclosed in
 a q element (as a test, you can point to the source for that), 
whereas the invented dialogue (which is the bit actually enclosed in 
quotation marks in the book) would not be wrapped in a q element, 
because it is dialogue, not 'phrasing content quoted from another 

Btw, i deliberately chose a simple example above. A more typical 
example from the book would be something like
> then Chrysaphius  picks up Edika's comment with a hint at what he 
has in mind, speaking through Vigilas, who becomes a shadow: ‘You too,
 Edika, **_would become the owner of wealth and of rooms with golden 
ceilings_** if you should ever decide to work for the Romans.’

So, following the logic outlined above, only the bold-italic part of 
the sentence would be inside a q element, and the quotes would be just
 part of the text (or might in some future time be captured by a 
dialogue element of some kind).

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