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Re: Using schema.org Dataset metadata properties

From: Jeni Tennison <jeni@jenitennison.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2014 10:24:38 +0100
To: Gregg Kellogg <gregg@greggkellogg.net>
Cc: W3C CSV on the Web Working Group <public-csv-wg@w3.org>, Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>
Message-ID: <etPan.541801d6.1a32234b.14e@jenit.local>
Gregg,

I’d thought that we would define publisher in the JSON-LD context as:

  "publisher": { "@id": “schema:publisher", "@type": "@id” }

which would mean that any literal string would be interpreted as a URL.

Jeni

-----Original Message-----
From: Gregg Kellogg <gregg@greggkellogg.net>
Reply: Gregg Kellogg <gregg@greggkellogg.net>>
Date: 15 September 2014 at 21:29:11
To: Jeni Tennison <jeni@jenitennison.com>>
Cc: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>>, W3C CSV on the Web Working Group <public-csv-wg@w3.org>>
Subject:  Re: Using schema.org Dataset metadata properties

>  
> Gregg Kellogg
> gregg@greggkellogg.net
>  
> On Sep 15, 2014, at 6:57 PM, Jeni Tennison wrote:
>  
> > Ivan,
> >
> > Given that we’re adopting JSON-LD for the metadata file, anyone *can* use any vocabulary.  
> I was thinking that we should including the binding of ‘dc’ to the Dublin Core namespace  
> so that people can easily add metadata in that scheme if they want to.
> >
> > I think there is huge value in having a predictable structure to metadata, as it helps  
> with validation, display and conversion. Adopting JSON-LD in effect enforces a particular  
> structure, eg saying that “publisher” must look like:
> >
> > “publisher”: {
> > “@id”: "http://www.hefce.ac.uk/“,
> > “name": "Higher Education Funding Council for England (HEFCE)"
> > }
> >
> > or
> >
> > “publisher”: "http://www.hefce.ac.uk/“
> >
> > and not
> >
> > “publisher”: "Higher Education Funding Council for England (HEFCE)"
> >
> > Adopting schema.org normatively would mean saying that “publisher” means what it  
> means in schema.org, which I think is what we would want to do.
>  
> +1, but note that the schema.org content model for publisher would allow either a URI  
> or a plain literal in this place.
>  
> I do think that using schema.org is the most forward-thinking way to go, and as there is  
> quite an active community, perhaps more amenable to change driven by our use cases, if  
> the need arises.
>  
> Certainly having a standard context which includes common prefixes, similar to RDFa’s  
> initial context, makes a lot of sense.
>  
> Gregg
>  
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Jeni
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Ivan Herman  
> > Reply: Ivan Herman >
> > Date: 14 September 2014 at 08:07:03
> > To: Jeni Tennison >
> > Cc: W3C CSV on the Web Working Group >
> > Subject: Re: Using schema.org Dataset metadata properties
> >
> >> I have a meta-question on this. Is the list of terms listed in the document normative  
> or
> >> informative? The current document does not make a difference (ie, by default, it is  
> normative,
> >> including the references), but I presume this is simply because we never asked ourselves  
> >> the question.
> >>
> >> At the moment, the text says:
> >>
> >> [[[
> >> Descriptions may contain any properties defined by [DC-TERMS] to describe the table.  
> >> This specification does not define any application behaviour associated with these  
> >> properties being present, except that validation of metadata files must check that,  
> >> if they are present, they adhere to the syntax defined here.
> >> ]]]
> >>
> >> This at first suggests that the [Dublin Core] vocabulary is informative (and optional)  
> >> but then it mandates specific value syntax for some of the properties when validating.  
> >> I think it could be debated whether this additional validation requirement actually  
> >> makes the reference normative, but it is not clear. I guess the question is whether  
> we
> >> will have a notion of conforming metadata, of a possible metadata validator, and what  
> >> they are supposed to exactly do.
> >>
> >> Why is this question relevant? Because if the whole section is normative than we MUST  
> >> make a choice on whether, for a specific goal, we choose DCTERM or schema. If it is informative,  
> >> there is no problem referring to both and let the end user decide (and, actually, the  
> exact
> >> value syntax issue could also be removed simply referring to the definition of these  
> >> terms by DCMI and schema.org, respectively.)
> >>
> >> (There is also an editorial/W3C issue. There are fairly stringent rules on whether  
> we
> >> can refer, _normatively_, to an external document. While this is not a problem with  
> DCTERM,
> >> this has not yet done before for schema.org, and it may lead to some discussions...)  
> >>
> >> Ivan
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 13 Sep 2014, at 18:28 , Jeni Tennison wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> In the current metadata document here:
> >>>
> >>> http://w3c.github.io/csvw/metadata/#common-properties
> >>>
> >>> the spec maps adopts the list of Dublin Core properties for describing tables etc.  
> As
> >> ISSUE 6 says, this might not be the right choice: there might be other standard vocabularies  
> >> that should be used instead or as well.
> >>>
> >>> On the call this week, Dan suggested using schema.org instead, namely the properties  
> >> on Dataset here:
> >>>
> >>> http://schema.org/Dataset
> >>>
> >>> The properties there are informed by DCAT which itself was informed by Dublin Core.  
> >>>
> >>> Any thoughts?
> >>>
> >>> Jeni
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: CSV on the Web Working Group Issue Tracker
> >>> Reply: CSV on the Web Working Group >
> >>> Date: 10 September 2014 at 13:23:37
> >>> To: jeni@jenitennison.com >
> >>> Subject: ACTION-26: Write to mailing list re using schema.org rather than dublin  
> core
> >> for metadata about csv files, then binding decision on following telcon (CSV on the  
> Web
> >> Working Group)
> >>>
> >>>> ACTION-26: Write to mailing list re using schema.org rather than dublin core for  
> metadata
> >>>> about csv files, then binding decision on following telcon (CSV on the Web Working  
> >> Group)
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/csvw/track/actions/26
> >>>>
> >>>> On: Jeni Tennison
> >>>> Due: 2014-09-17
> >>>>
> >>>> If you do not want to be notified on new action items for this group, please update  
> your
> >>>> settings at:
> >>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/csvw/track/users/33715#settings
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Jeni Tennison
> >>> http://www.jenitennison.com/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----
> >> Ivan Herman, W3C
> >> Digital Publishing Activity Lead
> >> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
> >> mobile: +31-641044153
> >> GPG: 0x343F1A3D
> >> WebID: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf#me
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Jeni Tennison
> > http://www.jenitennison.com/
>  
>  
>  
>  

--  
Jeni Tennison
http://www.jenitennison.com/
Received on Tuesday, 16 September 2014 09:25:05 UTC

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