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Re: Requirements for (level >=3) tests

From: Alan Stearns <stearns@adobe.com>
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2012 06:49:49 -0800
To: Aryeh Gregor <ayg@aryeh.name>, "css21testsuite@gtalbot.org" <css21testsuite@gtalbot.org>
CC: CSS-testsuite <public-css-testsuite@w3.org>
Message-ID: <CB68EF0D.BAB5%stearns@adobe.com>
On 2/21/12 6:35 AM, "Aryeh Gregor" <ayg@aryeh.name> wrote:

> 2012/2/20 "Gérard Talbot" <css21testsuite@gtalbot.org>:
>> CSS was designed to reuse code, to reduce code and to help create a
>> clear separation of structure and presentation. With inline style, you
>> have none of these. By adopting such guideline, the test suite is
>> promoting best coding practices for CSS.
> 
> In cases where you know that the style will only ever be used once, I
> don't see how these considerations are relevant.  Inline style exists
> for a reason -- it's shorter and clearer to write
>   <div style="foo">
> than
>   <div id="abc"><style>#abc { foo }</style>
> This is in fact why inline style exists.
> 
> I'm not sure how the test suite's markup promotes any coding practices
> for CSS, since almost nobody is going to look at the source code for
> the tests.  But I would say to the contrary that if the tests use
> <style> where inline style would be more succinct, they're promoting
> *bad* coding practice.  Good coding practice is to place style inline
> or out-of-band depending on which results in clearer and shorter
> markup, not to always use out-of-band style no matter what.
> 
>> We can not see the test you are referring to.
> 
> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/file/4038ffaa5d82/layout/reftests/transf
> orm-3d/sorting-1a.html
> 
> Notice how #big is before #small, but <div id=small> is before <div
> id=big>.  Also notice how even if that weren't true, you'd have to
> first look down at the bottom of the file to figure out where the four
> divs are, then look back up to the style keeping that in mind.
> (#stage is parent of #parent, #parent is parent of #big and #small.)
> 
> My rewritten version:
> 
> http://hg.csswg.org/test/file/5d82a43286ea/contributors/aryehgregor/incoming/r
> ef-3d/sorting-1a.html
> 
> Notice that it's ten lines instead of 35, and can be read sequentially
> without having to remember anything.
> 
> This is just a motivating example, of course.  Whether there's one or
> a thousand is not the point -- it's the underlying issues that matter,
> and the example only illustrates those issues.

While I agree with you that the order of big and small should be consistent
in that particular test, I very much disagree that the compact inline form
of this test is clearer.

Inline styles that set a single property are usually fine, but once you have
a second property (or more) inline I find it much harder to scan. I strongly
prefer one property per line in a style block when there's more than one
property to read.

I find this particular case a motivating example for a separating style from
markup.

Thanks,

Alan
Received on Tuesday, 21 February 2012 14:50:26 GMT

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