W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-credentials@w3.org > September 2014

Re: getting more sophisticated - Re: UseCases

From: Tim Holborn <timothy.holborn@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2014 08:05:56 +1000
Cc: Credentials Community Group <public-credentials@w3.org>
Message-Id: <7BF25833-D18E-4D2E-B34B-DD98F2063E3F@gmail.com>
To: Manu Sporny <msporny@digitalbazaar.com>
I won’t reiterate what i’ve stated here[1] 

[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-credentials/2014Sep/0027.html

On 23 Sep 2014, at 2:40 am, Manu Sporny <msporny@digitalbazaar.com> wrote:

> On 09/14/2014 09:17 PM, Tim Holborn wrote:
>> *P2P Advertising.  (+/- arbitration) * I want to pay specific CPC/CPM
>> if used on specified domains.  I provide a payment Credential in the
>> summary document to make a claim or to initiate claim for this
>> offer.
> 
> What's a "payment Credential"? Isn't the above the opposite of a Web
> Payments 'Offer'? Something like a "Bid" or"WantToBuy"? In any case,
> this seems like it belongs in the Web Payments use cases?
> 

Website would need an identity / payment ID?  Perhaps the ‘offer’ also needs an ID.  

RE: SEMANTIC ADVERTISING CONCEPT
So; the brainchild (in concept) is: i create an advertising offer with predicates.  i load onto my WebServer, where that offer becomes identifiable by ‘agents’ that can then make an agreement and serve it up.  somehow usage is tracked, et.al. triggering settlement, etc.

The problem Andrew Mackie led me into; related to this concept of being able to decentralise advertising offers.  So, simple ‘agents’ could carry out tasks in a semantic (decentralised) fashion.

I’m thinking now; this has more to do with some sort of checksum credential; some way of declaring a file is what it’s publisher intended it to be, for web-documents.  

ie: 
SCRIPT = same script, will carry out function as intended.
FOAF = as defined by original author.


>> *Selling a bike* I create a document to advertise the availability of
>> my pushbike, including the amount i seek for the bike and the terms
>> (pick-up only).
> 
> Another Web Payments use case, right?

Yes. Again; legal instrument thing - trying to ensure it’s you selling your bike, not ya sister, brother or the kids at school who took it home.

> 
>> I create a document to advertise the sale of a T-Shirt.  I display 
>> the price (in local currency) and link to a shipping provider (to 
>> automate the shipping fees)
> 
> Web Payments use case?
> 

per above: NB: i’m talking about being able to ‘semantically’ discover these documents that may be stored in peoples individual ‘cloud storage accounts’. (meaning the site doing presentation may be different to the site where these documents are created / stored)

>> *Contribute* I use a credential when initiating PUT on a project, 
>> incorporating a multitude of others, and an agreement for 
>> contributing to project.  My credential is associated to my 
>> contributions for the purpose of remunerating me if the project moves
>> to a point where a revenue is identified
>> 
>> NOTES:  Some of these Bitmark [1] images show a variety of
>> use-cases. In the above example; the use-case denotes a ‘proof of
>> stake’ rather than the use of a transactional credential of a fixed
>> financial integer (meaning $1).  In the “contribute” example, a
>> contributor may provide 1% of total contribution, or 10% of total
>> contribution for stage 1, or 1% of total contribution to date, or
>> 0.5% of total contribution - upon the date that the project is
>> achieving critical mass (has a million users, is generating revenue,
>> etc.)
> 
> +1, although the details of percentage allocation is really a Web
> Payments use case?
> 
>> INVENT I write a document disclosing an invention i purport to have 
>> defined in a manner that would denote the work as being innovative.
>> I publish this specification, incorporating a credential that
>> provides a date-stamp (“priority date” esk).  I submit an offer
>> statement with respect to the use of the knowledge contained within
>> that document; and perhaps define a specified market (i.e. use can
>> MFG product for personal use or for commercial manufacture within
>> these restrictions).
> 
> How is this one different from the Certificate of Deliver use case you
> mentioned in the other email (other than being more specific)?

its’ not.  more of a technical marketing esk. comment.  perhaps still useful, agree with your determination for spec. definition purposes.

> 
>> EXISTING I have a patent or trademark.  I offer the use of this 
>> patent or trademark subject to “this” agreement.
> 
> I don't see what this has to do w/ Credentials, other than establishing
> the identity? Seems more like a smart contracts use case, which probably
> belongs in the Web Payments group?

Smart contract requires the legal instrument test. therein; credentials would be used, to support the payments function?

> 
>> *CREATIVE COMMONS (MEDIA)* I offer this content freely for civic use.
>> If you seek to print this photo, then i charge you $2 amount / Value.
>> (take to printer, printer software sees credential  / claim, charges
>> customer for print + fee / cost).
>> 
>> NOTE:  This concept goes something along the lines of inserting 
>> credential into metadata of media-file, whether the media-file is 
>> wholly incorporated or requires additional data to be acquired; 
>> through the acquisition and transmission of credentialing information
>> for the purpose of dynamically constructing the file. (i.e. media
>> file + streamed keyframes or timecode sequencing metadata, over
>> HTTPS).
> 
> Again, Web Payments? Isn't this an 'Offer’?

yes.  signature or ‘legal instrument’ test.
> 
>> DATA RIGHTS / PRIVACY Before i send you these credentials
> 
> This is a compound use case and has quite a number of moving parts. Can
> you please deconstruct it into individual use cases that can then be
> re-composed into the complex one you outlined. Focused use cases that
> can be composed usually tend to lead to better technologies and
> composability of those technologies than large monolithic use cases. I'm
> not saying the data rights / privacy stuff is too complex to tackle,
> just that we need to get it at the right level of abstraction in order
> to build something simple that is effective at tackling the problem.
> 

+1 no problem, and agreed.

> -- manu
> 
> -- 
> Manu Sporny (skype: msporny, twitter: manusporny, G+: +Manu Sporny)
> Founder/CEO - Digital Bazaar, Inc.
> blog: High-Stakes Credentials and Web Login
> http://manu.sporny.org/2014/identity-credentials/
Received on Monday, 22 September 2014 22:12:10 UTC

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