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Re: ACTION-47: Draft a chapter outline of "What is a Web App?"

From: Chaals McCathieNevile <w3b@chaals.com>
Date: Wed, 15 Aug 2012 15:24:38 +0200
To: "tomomi.imura@nokia.com" <tomomi.imura@nokia.com>, "tobie@fb.com" <tobie@fb.com>, "andrew.betts@ft.com" <andrew.betts@ft.com>, "jl3101@att.com" <jl3101@att.com>, "Tomaz Scavnicar" <tomaz.scavnicar@kodirnica.net>
Cc: "public-coremob@w3.org" <public-coremob@w3.org>
Message-ID: <op.wi23jcru22x22q@chaals.local>
On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 11:46:03 +0200, Tomaz Scavnicar  
<tomaz.scavnicar@kodirnica.net> wrote:

> Has anybody looked at the Wikipedia definition, I think its pretty good:

I think it is not bad as a rough explanation. If we wanted something  
normative that people could use to argue XXX is(n't) in scope it isn't  
tight enough, but I suspect that trying to find something like that is a  
waste of our time and will just get in the way of us producing something  
timely and useful.

cheers

Chaals

> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_application
>
> Tomał
> ________________________________________
> Od: tomomi.imura@nokia.com [tomomi.imura@nokia.com]
> Poslano: 14. avgust 2012 20:16
> Za: w3b@chaals.com; tobie@fb.com; andrew.betts@ft.com; jl3101@att.com;  
> tomaz.scavnicar@kodirnica.net
> Kp: public-coremob@w3.org
> Zadeva: Re: ACTION-47: Draft a chapter outline of "What is a Web App?"
>
> Hi guys,
>
> On 8/14/12 8:06 AM, "ext Chaals McCathieNevile" <w3b@chaals.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 14 Aug 2012 11:08:28 +0200, Tomaz Scavnicar
>> <tomaz.scavnicar@kodirnica.net> wrote:
>>
>>> It's an interesting question, because I think that we alerady live for
>>> a
>>> long time in an web app era, but they are just not understanded and
>>> interpreted like that :).
>>
>> Yes. I believe the first web application was a search field for the CERN
>> library. It effectively fulfilled Andrew's "doesn't use a page metaphor"
>> criteria even though it used a page-based *implementation*. Yandex  
>> doesn't
>> use a page metaphor to provide search results, even though we still use  
>> a
>> page-based implementation to a large extent. It also met Tobie's "it is
>> task-oriented" (as opposed to information-oriented).
>
>
> I think this is the important part to define web apps (vs. web pages),
> besides the technical definitions.
>
> People occasionally ask me what web apps differ from websites. Some  
> people
> argues that "web" is just "web".
>
> I usually say that web sites are mostly contents (to be consumed) while
> web apps are actual software that likely requires more user interactions
> (and I continue talking how UX matters).
>
>
>
>
>>
>> I think both of these features are useful to the definition of an app.
>>
>> Like Andrew, I am not sure if there is a lot of value in pinning down an
>> exact definition. If we are clearly talking about roughly the same  
>> things
>> when we argue about what to support, and if we can work our way through
>> "edge cases" after we have established common ground and solved most of
>> what are agreed to be core problems, I think that's god enough.
>> (Note that neither of those "ifs" are guaranteed to come true)
>>
>>> I think that there must be 2 definitions that define the web app. One
>>> defines technical requirements and one is defining user experience
>>> requirements and I think that these definitions need to be very minimal
>>>
>>> and clear.
>>> For me a web app would be like this:
>>> Technical requirements:
>>> -has a plug-in free experience, that offers a cross browser and cross
>>> device usability
>>> -uses cross browser code
>>
>> I think these criteria distinguish web app from other kinds of app, and
>> are useful ideas to keep in mind.
>>
>>> -has meta data that offers easy discovering
>>> -has something like desktop pinning or something that allows to access
>>> it instantly, with one click from the device
>>
>> These are common features but I don't think they are distinctive, or
>> necessary.
>>
>>> -touch support
>>
>> I don't think this matters at all to a definition. It's a feature of
>> well-built web content in general.
>
>
> Are we actually trying to define mobile web apps or web apps in general
> here?
>
> I think the touch support may not be directly a part of the definition  
> for
> web apps, however, the form factor related user interaction is relevant
> when we talk about mobile apps.
>
>>> User experience requirements:
>>> -Fits the screen, so we don't need to pan or zoom to see the whole
>>> content
>>> -has the same minimal cross browser and cross devices user experience
>>> with taking in count hardware limitations
>>> -touch first design (minimal margins around buttons, minimal size of
>>> clickable elements,....)
>>> I think that we must take in count that design is subjective, but some
>>> minimal requirements should be met.
>>> Things like caching,  page concept and similar are matter of design
>>> (technical and ux) and, maybe they can be understanded like
>>> differentiation factor from good and bad web apps.
>>
>> Actually I think all the UX stuff listed above distinguishes between  
>> good
>> and bad apps, rather than distinguishing apps from other things.
>>
>>> There will be also logical that we have a common place where this apps
>>> are available.
>>
>> "The Web". It's all available from Yandex. Or you might prefer to find
>> everything through Bing, or through links from a friend's twitter feed  
>> or
>>
>> as notes on your facebook wall, or all provided by someone you paid a  
>> lot
>>
>> of money to. Being able to aggregate things is great - but actually a
>> major feature of the Web is being able to *decentralise* things...
>>
>> cheers
>>
>> Chaals
>>
>> --
>> Chaals - standards declaimer
>>
>
>
> Thanks,
> Tomomi
>


-- 
Chaals - standards declaimer
Received on Wednesday, 15 August 2012 13:25:12 UTC

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