W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-bpwg@w3.org > March 2009

Re: FYI - "Mobile Web 2009 = Desktop Web 1998"

From: Bruce Lawson <brucel@opera.com>
Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 11:22:45 -0000
To: "Luca Passani" <passani@eunet.no>, public-bpwg@w3.org
Message-ID: <op.uqda77t9h8on37@bruce-pc>
[apologies; pressed sent too early on last incarnation of this message]

On Fri, 06 Mar 2009 08:07:06 -0000, Luca Passani <passani@eunet.no> wrote:

>
>  > Bruce Lawson
>  > Web Evangelist
>
> which of course explains your position: promoting one-web and  
> "convergence" (whatever it means) because it is consistent with both  
> Opera's client strategy (client-side reformatting on mobile devices) and  
> proxy-based offering (Opera Mini and Opera's cooperation with ByteMobile)

Hi Luca,

yes, I'm very lucky to work for a company whose philosophical premise I
share. And, as you noticed, I make no attempt to hide my affiliations.

> Back to the point, no, convergence isn't happening. One nasty side  
> effects of the attempt by companies like Novarra, Opera and others to  
> "demonstrate" that convergence is happening is the attempt to redefine  
> HTTP and the rules on which the success of the web is built. This is a  
> disaster and needs to be stopped.

We're totally open: Opera Mini quite clearly states "Is there any
end-to-end security between my handset and — for example — paypal.com or
my bank? No. If you need full end-to-end encryption, you should use a full
Web browser such as Opera Mobile."

Barclays Bank recommends it http://www.barclays.mobi/

Opera mobile does not "attempt to redefine HTTP".

> The success of the web was based on the basic assumption that whoever  
> could publish web content and they would know what end-users would see.

No. The success of the web was based on the fact that any internet-enabled  
device could render the text.

"Anyone who slaps a 'this page is best viewed with Browser X' label on a  
Web page appears to be yearning for the bad old days, before the Web, when  
you had very little chance of reading a document written on another  
computer, another word processor, or another network."
   -- Tim Berners-Lee in Technology Review, July 1996

>
> Some applications are naturally mobile only (think ringtone/wallpapers  
> downloads).

Yes, but that's an edge case - entirely device-specific content.


> The way Opera is trying to "enforce" convergence now is messy and tries  
> to replace what content owners have created with a bastardized version  
> of it


If I have a black and white TV, I can watch a technicolour movie in black
and white, regardless of the director's intention.

Content owners create content, and they own it. They recommend display but
do not own the end user's experience. If you have an old browser, a site
coded with progressive enhancement  might not show the styling, but it
will show the content.

Users can apply user css to any site and change its look and feel.

If your site can be found in Google, the search results will probably have
some of your content below the link to your site, and it will look like a
Google search result and not be in your site's preferred font or colour.

bruce
Received on Friday, 6 March 2009 11:23:40 UTC

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