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[minutes] 28 April 2009 Teleconference

From: Francois Daoust <fd@w3.org>
Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2009 17:09:22 +0200
Message-ID: <49F71C22.8060407@w3.org>
To: Mobile Web Best Practices Working Group WG <public-bpwg@w3.org>
Hi guys,

The minutes of today's call are available at:
  http://www.w3.org/2009/04/28-bpwg-minutes.html

... and copied as text below


Resolutions taken during the call:
  * add a placeholder for login BP in the current draft and publish a 
new Working Draft of the Mobile Web Application Best Practices document 
based on the 17th April 2009 version.

  * pending EOWG approval, publish the latest version of "Relationship 
between Mobile Web Best Practices (MWBP) and Web Content Accessibility 
Guidelines (WCAG)" as a last public working draft, with a view to 
issuing a WG Note shortly afterwards.

  * properly define X-Device-* HTTP headers in the Content 
Transformation guidelines using references to the appropriate sections 
of RFC2616


Others:
We've started to review the proposed new abstract for the guidelines and 
agreed that "Web resources" should replace "Web applications". Further 
review needed:
  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0037.html


Thanks,
Francois.


-----
28 Apr 2009

    [2]Agenda

       [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0038.html

    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2009/04/28-bpwg-irc

Attendees

    Present
           tomhume, Francois, Adam, EdC, yeliz, miguel, achuter, jeffs,
           SeanP, jsmanrique

    Regrets
           jo, DKA, rob, kai, abel, nacho, SangwhanMoon, Bruce, Bryan

    Chair
           francois

    Scribe
           yeliz

Contents

      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]mobileOK Checker
          2. [6]Mobile Web Application Best Practices
          3. [7]Mobile/Accessibility document
          4. [8]Content Transformation
          5. [9]Feature phones vs. Smartphone
      * [10]Summary of Action Items
      _________________________________________________________

mobileOK Checker

    francois: The reason this is topic is agenda, I made some changes in
    the library, most of the bugs are fixed
    ... thanks to Miguel and Abel
    ... there are a few minor enhancements in the pipeline
    ... there are some possible enhancements that could be done in the
    way resources are described
    ... Need to discuss on the mobileOK mailing list before we go ahead
    with those changes
    ... I just wanted to give an update on the status of mobileOK

Mobile Web Application Best Practices

    Francois: Adam updated the document

    <francois> [11]new MWABP draft

      [11] 
http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/Drafts/BestPractices-2.0/ED-mobile-bp2-20091704

    Adam: there is a new draft
    ... Thanks to Eduardo, it looks powerful, I will work on your
    comments, and then raise issues if
    ... something is not clear

    <jeffs> should be able to finish up empirical tests of canvas & SVG
    this week

    Adam: There is one outsanding action that may be worth revisiting on
    login forms...
    ... We can either go ahead and discuss them
    ... What we recommended as best practice is not recommended by
    security people
    ... looking forward to comments and feedback

    Francois: I think Eduardo had quite a lot of comments about this,
    any comment Eduardo?

    Eduardo: Not quite
    ... would be good to have more details about the argument

    <francois> [12]resolutions on logins

      [12] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Feb/0070.html

    Adam: made recommendations on how to format passwords, etc. I don't
    think it is a good idea to have them presented differently on mobile
    Web
    ... we can either be silent on this or discuss it further

    Eduardo: Are you saying that we ignore the resolution and do
    something else?

    Adam: we can remain silent on the topic and simply go on with a BP
    that says "ease login".

    Francois: I think I like your suggestion, it is an important topic

    Adam: it's important to put BP in the user experience section
    ... we made some other changes to BP since then
    ... and now it talks about something slightly different

    Eduardo: this is OK with me

    Adam: I haven't actually looked at the existing resolutions, but
    they don't match with the existing versions
    ... as they talk about some BPs that don't exist anymore

    <francois> ACTION: adam to draft a BP on login forms adapting
    previous resolutions on the topic for discussion [recorded in
    [13]http://www.w3.org/2009/04/28-bpwg-minutes.html#action01]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-957 - Draft a BP on login forms adapting
    previous resolutions on the topic for discussion [on Adam Connors -
    due 2009-05-05].

    Adam: Waiting for feedback on the document, haven't addressed
    Eduardo's comments yet

    Eduardo: there are a couple of points that need clarification
    ... my comments don't invalidate BPs but mainly clarifications are
    required

    Adam: I will address them later

    Francois: I also have some minor comments and I will post them later
    ... I wonder if it would be good to publish a new draft, a working
    group draft
    ... the new document is way different from the one published in the
    past
    ... so it would be good to publish a new WG draft

    Adam: I think that would be good, yes from me
    ... looking forward to more comments from the community

    Francois: anybody against publication of a new WG draft?

    Eduardo: there are two BPs missing, would that be a problem in
    publising a draft?

    Francois: no, that won't be a problem, we will just put editorial
    notes

    <francois> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: add a placeholder for login BP in
    the current draft and publish the a new Working Draft of the Mobile
    Web Application Best Practices document based on the 17th April 2009
    version.

    <Adam> +1

    <EdC> +1

    <achuter> +1

    <francois> +1

    <miguel> +1

    +1

    <SeanP> +1

    Adam: I can publish it tomorrow

    Francois: I can do the necessary changes to move it to a WG draft

    RESOLUTION: add a placeholder for login BP in the current draft and
    publish a new Working Draft of the Mobile Web Application Best
    Practices document based on the 17th April 2009 version.

    Francois: Jeff do you have any update on Canvas?

    Jeff: I haven't had any chance to complete it

Mobile/Accessibility document

    Francois: Alan posted a new email today

    <francois> [14]Alan's latest email on the topic

      [14] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0041.html

    [15]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/TaskForces/Accessibility/d
    rafts/ED-mwbp-wcag-20090428/#approaches

      [15] 
http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/TaskForces/Accessibility/drafts/ED-mwbp-wcag-20090428/#approaches

    Francois: This is the latest version
    ... is the goal to publish a new WG draft and then a WG note?

    Alan: yes, that's the idea, idea is to get more feedback

    <achuter>
    [16]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/TaskForces/Accessibility/d
    rafts/ED-mwbp-wcag-20090428/#approaches

      [16] 
http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/TaskForces/Accessibility/drafts/ED-mwbp-wcag-20090428/#approaches

    Francois: I suppose it is the EO position
    ... not many changes, right?

    Alan: The main change been that WCAG is required by all sites but
    not BP
    ... but then we updated that

    Francois: is there something that needs to be reviewed?

    Alan: only that parag. that compares WCAG and MWBP?

    Francois: I read it several times, and it looks OK to me

    Alan: take a resolution to be published as a Working draft
    ... I have implemented the changes EO asked for
    ... I think they need to vote as well

    EO: Education and Outreach WG

    Francois: If they say on Friday that they are OK with this version,
    we will go ahead and publish
    ... If Education and Outreach WG say on Friday that they are OK with
    this version, we will go ahead and publish

    <francois> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: pending EOWG approval, publish the
    latest version of "Relationship between Mobile Web Best Practices
    (MWBP) and Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG)" as a last
    public working draft, with a view to issuing a WG Note shortly
    afterwards.

    <EdC> +1

    <achuter> +1

    <Adam> +1

    <jeffs> +1

    +1

    <francois> +1

    <miguel> +1

    <SeanP> +1

    RESOLUTION: pending EOWG approval, publish the latest version of
    "Relationship between Mobile Web Best Practices (MWBP) and Web
    Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG)" as a last public working
    draft, with a view to issuing a WG Note shortly afterwards.

Content Transformation

    <francois> [17]fd's email on X-Device-* headers registration

      [17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0023.html

    <EdC> q

    Francois: this requires Jo's approval

    Eduardo: regarding the formal definition, you put the whole thing,
    wouldn't be useful to put the corresponding ..

    Francois: I agree, everyone would understand what it means, so I
    think you are right

    <francois> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: Properly define X-Device-* HTTP
    headers in the Content Transformation guidelines using references to
    the appropriate sections of RFC2616

    <tomhume> +1

    <EdC> +1

    <francois> +1

    +1

    <SeanP> +1

    <jeffs> +1

    RESOLUTION: Properly define X-Device-* HTTP headers in the Content
    Transformation guidelines using references to the appropriate
    sections of RFC2616

    Francois: not sure about the remaining topics

    <EdC>
    [18]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0037.htm
    l

      [18] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0037.html

    <francois> [19]Eduardo's proposal for an abstract for CT

      [19] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Apr/0037.html

    Francois: "same origin policy" requires other people to be able to
    discuss so I suggest we postpone this

    <jeffs> +1 on Francois' comment

    Francois: lets look at Abstract suggested by Eduardo
    ... I think it is quite long

    Sean: reference to Web applications, I know what it means but it can
    be confusing
    ... usually people do transformation on simpler pages
    ... I think what Eduardo saying here is more than just simple Web
    pages, javascript involved, etc
    ... Web applications to me refers to Widgets

    Francois: what about saying "Web resources"
    ... Eduardo, what do you think about this?

    Eduardo: is there a standard terminology?

    Francois: yes, Web resources is the "standard" terminology
    ... need to find the exact definition for the record

    <francois> [20]WebArch definition of the Web and resources

      [20] http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/REC-webarch-20041215/#intro

    Francois: this document refers to "Web resources"
    ... this needs to be discussed on the mailing list. Can we postpone
    the discussion to next week?
    ... so people have time to look at it and discuss on the mailing
    list

Feature phones vs. Smartphone

    <francois> ISSUE-296?

    <trackbot> ISSUE-296 -- "feature phone vs. smartphone, which
    handsets will make large web traffic ?" -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [21]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/296

      [21] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/296

    <EdC> I already sent something.

    Francois: Jonathan asked for comments on the mailing list, we will
    not discuss on the call
    ... is there anything that we can possibly discuss here about your
    comment Eduardo?

    Eduardo: are the results of this discussion will be used?

    Francois: the result could affect Web applications BP but not
    directly

    Eduardo: I would be interested to get an overview of the terminology
    from far East, since we have people here from Korea
    ... South Korea, and Japan, so it would be good to know about the
    developments there

    Francois: Please take a look at the document and send an email to
    the mailing list
    ... any other business?

    <jeffs> <waves/>

    Francois: Thanks for all attending

    <EdC> bye, till next week.

    <jsmanrique> bye

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: adam to draft a BP on login forms adapting previous
    resolutions on the topic for discussion [recorded in
    [22]http://www.w3.org/2009/04/28-bpwg-minutes.html#action01]

    [End of minutes]
Received on Tuesday, 28 April 2009 15:09:58 UTC

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