Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 Role Landmark

Alex, 

That is a good question. We did not think about the special case Form Role which is also a landmark.

https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#form <https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#form>

I will ask but the value in using IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK is that you know it is a landmark and can then got to the xml-roles attribute to grab the actual landmark type. 

I think that it would be easy to check with the landmark role or the form role.

Brett, would you want to stick with the Form Role or use the IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK for it and then look to the xml-roles for the form role? 



Rich


Rich Schwerdtfeger




> On Apr 13, 2016, at 9:23 AM, Alexander Surkov <surkov.alexander@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi, all. I'm not yet clear on definition for the new role. What role should we use to expose a 'landmark' role that have a better role match, like FORM role?
> 
> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 10:48 PM, Rich Schwerdtfeger <richschwer@gmail.com <mailto:richschwer@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Alright, please add the role to IA2. We will update the ARIA mapping spec and I will let some of the ATs know and We will need to let Google know as well.
> 
> Rich
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On Feb 23, 2016, at 4:50 PM, James Teh <jamie@nvaccess.org <mailto:jamie@nvaccess.org>> wrote:
> >
> > That's a fair justification. We don't have a collections interface for IA2, so if we did want to fetch all landmarks, we have to walk the entire tree in-process, in which case checking the role is about the same as checking xml-roles. Still, it does make sense and I'm happy to accept it given the consensus.
> >
> > I'll leave convincing the other Windows ATs up to someone else, though...
> >
> > Jamie
> >
> >> On 24/02/2016 4:34 AM, Joanmarie Diggs wrote:
> >> Hey Jamie.
> >>
> >> At least on my platform, getting all of the ROLE_LANDMARK objects (e.g.
> >> for a list of landmarks dialog) via AtspiCollection is a lot more
> >> performant than getting all the elements and then filtering out the
> >> non-landmarks (99-100% of the set) via object attribute. The xml-roles
> >> value remains useful for those cases where it matters what type of
> >> landmark a particular element happens to be.
> >>
> >> If you don't have a similar advantage on your platform, then I guess the
> >> justification is the desire to keep our completely different platforms
> >> as aligned as possible. And if you accept ROLE_LANDMARK, the next time
> >> one of us has to compromise/give in, it will be my turn. <grins>
> >>
> >> --joanie
> >>
> >>> On 02/22/2016 08:37 PM, James Teh wrote:
> >>> Hi Rich,
> >>>
> >>> I don't necessarily have an objection to introducing a new role, but I
> >>> also don't quite follow the justification.
> >>>
> >>> I follow that region became a subclass of landmark. However, I don't
> >>> follow how this changes the "landmark" role; if anything, it changes the
> >>> "region" role. And even then, the region role never had its own IA2 role
> >>> in the first place. Furthermore, since we have to look at xml-roles
> >>> anyway (as we always have, despite my objection years ago, but that's an
> >>> entirely different story), I don't follow how the landmark role is useful.
> >>>
> >>> I'm sure I'm missing something here. Can you enlighten me? :)
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Jamie
> >>>
> >>>> On 20/02/2016 9:37 AM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> >>>> Hi Alex,
> >>>>
> >>>> I am following up on this earlier discussion regarding needing an
> >>>> IA2_LANDMARK_ROLE
> >>>>
> >>>> http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2016-January/001993.html <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/accessibility-ia2/2016-January/001993.html>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> A fundamental change from ARIA 1.0 is we now have the role “region” as
> >>>> a descendant of a role of landmark:
> >>>>
> >>>> https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-1.1/#region <https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-1.1/#region>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> So, this is the revised set of landmarks:
> >>>>
> >>>> https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-1.1/#landmark_roles <https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-1.1/#landmark_roles>
> >>>>
> >>>> The reason for this is developers have been using labelledy regions as
> >>>> landmarks and in HTML5 we now have a section landmark which will
> >>>> default to a role of “region” if it has a label on it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Given this change we would like this a new IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK that
> >>>> matches the landmark role we now have in ATK/ATSPI. The xml-roles
> >>>> attribute would take the value of the actual role as we know.
> >>>>
> >>>> Is there any objection to introducing this new role in IA2?
> >>>>
> >>>> We are trying to lock down ARIA 1.1 and this is one of the issues we
> >>>> need to address.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks,
> >>>>
> >>>> Rich
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Accessibility-ia2 mailing list
> >>>> Accessibility-ia2@lists.linuxfoundation.org <mailto:Accessibility-ia2@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
> >>>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2 <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2>
> >>> --
> >>> James Teh
> >>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited
> >>> Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <tel:%2B61%207%203149%203306>
> >>> www.nvaccess.org <http://www.nvaccess.org/>
> >>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess <http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess>
> >>> Twitter: @NVAccess
> >>> SIP: jamie@nvaccess.org <mailto:jamie@nvaccess.org>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
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> >>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2 <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/accessibility-ia2>
> >
> > --
> > James Teh
> > Executive Director, NV Access Limited
> > Ph +61 7 3149 3306 <tel:%2B61%207%203149%203306>
> > www.nvaccess.org <http://www.nvaccess.org/>
> > Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess <http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess>
> > Twitter: @NVAccess
> > SIP: jamie@nvaccess.org <mailto:jamie@nvaccess.org>
> >
>