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Minutes: APA WG 9th of August

From: Michiel Bijl <michiel.list@moiety.me>
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2017 23:13:44 +0200
Message-Id: <8D6DD873-7E9C-4A54-91F4-63BA954F3F36@moiety.me>
To: W3C WAI Accessible Platform Architectures <public-apa@w3.org>
The minutes for todays APA call can be found in this e-mail or at the following URL: https://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html

— Michiel

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

     Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference

09 Aug 2017

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-irc

Attendees

   Present
          janina, Joanmarie_Diggs, MichielBijl, IanPouncey,
          MichaelC, chaals1, Léonie

   Regrets
   Chair
          janina

   Scribe
          MichielBijl

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]preview agenda with items from two minutes
         2. [5]TPAC 2017
            https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2017
         3. [6]Task Force Checkins
         4. [7]Actions Checkin (Specs)
            https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/products/8
         5. [8]Input Events Redux
         6. [9]Push API Next Steps
         7. [10]new on TR
            http://www.w3.org/TR/tr-status-drafts.html
     * [11]Summary of Action Items
     * [12]Summary of Resolutions
     __________________________________________________________

   <janina> [13]http://www.w3.org/TR/notifications/

     [13] http://www.w3.org/TR/notifications/

   <MichaelC> present=

   <scribe> scribe: MichielBijl

preview agenda with items from two minutes

   JS: Been asked to talk about Push API

   Chaals and Léonie are joining us fro that conversation

   JS: Any news?

TPAC 2017 [14]https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2017

     [14] https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2017

   MB: Got a new job! Now at Funda in the Netherlands

Task Force Checkins

   JS: Ian anything to update?

   IP: Would like to ask for some time next week so I can work
   through most of the things

   JS: You’re on

   IP: Want to provide some sort of update for the open issues

   Do some prioritising

   JS: That we’ll do

   Any items from other task forces?

   MC: Payments Taskforce?

   JS: Haven’t heard anything, need to find Katie

   Did ask Judy about Katie sighting

   She should slowly make her way back to W3C activities

   MC: Just wanted to check that I didn’t miss anything because
   it’s still inactive
   .

Actions Checkin (Specs)
[15]https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/products/8

     [15] https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/products/8

Input Events Redux

   JS: PF before APA has had a long story with trying to get
   things right with input events

   We have had a lot of comments

   <chaals1> [Note that it is generally a good idea to talk to
   Johannes Wilm directly whenever discussing this topic]

   Some have been accepted

   <MichaelC>
   [16]https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Input_Events_Level_2

     [16] https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Input_Events_Level_2

   <janina>
   [17]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa/2017Mar/0013
   .html

     [17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa/2017Mar/0013.html

   ^ Questions we need to respond to

   Not sure how to describe where we are with this

   Anyone they feel they can summarise this?

   We’re leaving this hanging, and would like to come to a
   resolution on it

   <chaals1> The webPlat editing APIs TF generally meets once per
   month, last one yesterday but it was postponed.

   LW: The Editing TF might be a good place to start

   <janina> Chls, do you know when exactly Editing TF meets? Day?
   Hour?

   CMN: Their first question is about how an AT gets a
   notification of an input event

   I think we need to discuss that with them

   Not sure where the AT is listening for that

   The app that’s running picks that up and resets the event and
   fire its own

   You would need to be able to chain from the app

   This is about clarifying what changes need to be made

   Work on use cases

   “Where are they getting the input event?”

   <chaals1> [I assume it is platform-specific - and may also
   depend on applications]

   JD: Might depend on the platform

   I’m getting it from the application, but not sure what happens
   on the Mac

   It would be a platform specific question you might ask?

   CMN: Absolutely a platform-specific question

   Is there an issue for this?

   Can I ask someone in APA to file one if not so we can track it?

   JS: We can file an issue as I’m not sure we have one right now

   MC: Is this an AAM issue?

   JD: Not sure it is

   CMN: At this stage it’s not clear it should be in the API
   mappings
   ...

   Check it’s being done

   JS: I think that’s reasonable

   CMN: Issue is to ensure that the way input events are
   implemented and used that AT gets the message at the right
   moment

   JS: How do the different platforms do it?

   <MichaelC> ACTION: janina to file issue with input events about
   AT getting message properly [recorded in
   [18]http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html#action01]

     [18] http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html#action01

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-2139 - File issue with input events
   about at getting message properly [on Janina Sajka - due
   2017-08-16].

   <MichaelC> action-2139?

   <trackbot> action-2139 -- Janina Sajka to File issue with input
   events about at getting message properly -- due 2017-08-16 --
   OPEN

   <trackbot> [19]http://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/actions/2139

     [19] http://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/actions/2139

   <chaals1> [There are at least a couple of editing frameworks
   that have done a lot of work on accessibility and probably have
   some insight]

   Anything else on input events we want to discuss?

   MC: There’s still a pending action on it

   I know you have two anyways

   <MichaelC> action-2139:
   [20]https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Input_Events_Level_2

     [20] https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Input_Events_Level_2

   <trackbot> Notes added to action-2139 File issue with input
   events about at getting message properly.

   <MichaelC> action-2139: see also action-2124

   <trackbot> Notes added to action-2139 File issue with input
   events about at getting message properly.

Push API Next Steps

   <MichaelC> action-2124: see also action-2139

   <trackbot> Notes added to action-2124 Follow up with johannes
   wilm on input events 1 and 2 wrt our comments on input events
   non-leveled.

   JS: We’re developing use cases that we’re starting to talk
   about on the Do Not Disturb level

   We got a use case from Ted Drake for a list of situation where
   you want to use DND

   Have recently compared W3C Notification API with the WHATWG one

   <Zakim> chaals, you wanted to talk about their first question
   and to ask about the differences in detail

   <chaals1> CMN: Are there other significant differences besidess
   the accessibility stuff? What are the accessibility statements
   that are different?

   <janina> [21]https://notifications.spec.whatwg.org/

     [21] https://notifications.spec.whatwg.org/

   <MichaelC>
   [22]https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Notifications_API

     [22] https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Notifications_API

   <chaals1> ... one way to proceed would be to clearly request
   the Push spec to reference the W3C notification spec as the
   reference to use, explicitly because accessibility may
   otherwise be compromised...

   <janina> [23]http://www.w3.org/TR/notifications/

     [23] http://www.w3.org/TR/notifications/

   <janina> Diff indicates W3C has Sec 2.1 not in WHAT

   LW: The W3C Web Notifications spec went to Rec in 2015 and the
   WG closed/

   <janina> Also last paragraph of W3C Sec. 4 has been watered
   down by WHAT

   MC: No
   ... It’s going to be hard for us to do a HTML diff

   JS: So what’s the useful way to proceed on this

   CMN: *breaking up*

   JS: Anyone willing to do a comparison?

   LW: Not sure what we’re trying to accomplish by doing a diff

   <chaals1> [No point doing an automatic diff, because the specs
   are different. A parallel analysis by a human would show what
   the significant differences are...]

   MC: Our ultimate issue is that push API does something that
   creates an accessibility problem/

   <chaals1> [... If it's only accessibility they can refer to
   W3C. Otherwise they can refer to the accessibility guidance in
   addition to the wwg push spec.]]

   Push API told us to go to Notification API

   LW: Not sure we can do anything about a non-W3C spec ;)

   Depending on the W3C Notification spec is not much help either
   as the WG has closed

   Would suggest filing an issue on the WHATWG spec

   MC: A PR would be even better

   LW: Might also be worth suggesting the idea of a DND feature to
   the Push API editors too.

   *scribe without audio*

   MC: The language we request be added to the Notification API
   spec

   <chaals1> [as a starting point, request PushAPI to add a note
   in their informative reference to Notifications, adding

   JS: I can start the plain English version

   If someone can help me with the code

   MC: Yes, I can do that

   If you can look at where in the doc it needs to go

   JS: Sounds good

   Michael, any new specs?

new on TR [24]http://www.w3.org/TR/tr-status-drafts.html

     [24] http://www.w3.org/TR/tr-status-drafts.html

   <chaals1> "Please note that for accessibility reasons, sections
   X and Y of w3c notifications should be taken into account by
   implementations"...

   MC: Want to bring up WebVVT

   There’s now an active request for a review

   <MichaelC> [25]WebVTT: The Web Video Text Tracks Format

     [25] https://www.w3.org/TR/webvtt1/

   <MichaelC> [26]Credential Management Level 1

     [26] https://www.w3.org/TR/credential-management-1/

   MC: reviewed it a while ago

   Decided to go back to it

   JS: Who did it before?

   MC: Fred

   <MichaelC> [27]Verifiable Claims Data Model and Representations

     [27] https://www.w3.org/TR/verifiable-claims-data-model/

   > Driver's licenses are used to claim that we are capable of
   operating a motor vehicle, university degrees can be used to
   claim our education status, and government-issued passports
   enable holders to travel between countries. This specification
   provides a standard way to express these sorts of claims on the
   Web in a way that is cryptographically secure, privacy
   respecting, and automatically verifiable.

   MC: My gut tells me we don’t have to worry about this

   JS: Might be some UI

   MC: Not sure how this would impact us

   Mostly data models

   That’s it for TR then

   sg/CN:/CMN:/

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: janina to file issue with input events about AT
   getting message properly [recorded in
   [28]http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html#action01]

     [28] http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html#action01

Summary of Resolutions

   [End of minutes]
     __________________________________________________________


    Minutes formatted by David Booth's [29]scribe.perl version
    1.152 ([30]CVS log)
    $Date: 2017/08/09 17:02:34 $
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     [30] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

   [Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.152  of Date: 2017/02/06 11:04:15
Check for newer version at [31]http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/
scribe/

     [31] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: Irssi_ISO8601_Log_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/??/Push API/
Succeeded: s/some time/some time next week/
Succeeded: s/Katy/Katie/
Succeeded: s/editing/webPlat editing APIs/
Succeeded: s/event/event?/
Succeeded: s/Have also filed an issue against WHATWG’s spec//
Succeeded: s/LW: Is there any activity in the W3C Notification WG?/LW: T
he W3C Web Notifications spec went to Rec in 2015 and the WG closed/  /
Succeeded: s/CN:/CMN:/g
Succeeded: s/ultimate issue is that push API does something that creates
 an accessibility API/ultimate issue is that push API does something tha
t creates an accessibility problem/  /
Succeeded: s/Push/Notification/
Present: janina Joanmarie_Diggs MichielBijl IanPouncey MichaelC chaals1
Léonie
Found Scribe: MichielBijl
Inferring ScribeNick: MichielBijl
Found Date: 09 Aug 2017
Guessing minutes URL: [32]http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html
People with action items: janina

     [32] http://www.w3.org/2017/08/09-apa-minutes.html

WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines.
You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.



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