Re: JSON-LD context URI

All,

I agree that we should include it, and I'm happy with that URI.

I'll make the change to put that URI in the document instead of the current
xxx/yyy, create the context as a separate document in the github repo, and
then reply to Jeremie?

Rob



On Thu, Dec 4, 2014 at 8:11 AM, Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org> wrote:

> Rob, Paolo
>
> I have just checked with my colleagues, and it is perfectly fine to
> publish the @context document as, say,
>
> http://www.w3.org/ns/oa-context.jsonld
>
> (I just have dreamt up the URI, but that might be o.k.)
>
> It is up to you whether you prefer to let it go before the FPWD or want to
> include it. I have a preference for the latter, but it is your decision...
>
> Ivan
>
> > On 04 Dec 2014, at 09:57 , Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On 03 Dec 2014, at 23:06 , Robert Sanderson <azaroth42@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> All,
> >>
> >> Also not as chair*, the opinion I quickly expressed on the call this
> morning in more detail:
> >>
> >> 1.  We must create a new context URI.
> >
> > I agree.
> >
> >> I'm not sure if this needs to be done before FPWD or not?
> >
> > We should try. See below
> >
> >>
> >> Right now, we have placeholder text in the context appendix:
> >>        "... and can be referenced as http://www.w3.org/xxx/yyy."
> >
> > Yep, it is seeing that in the text that triggered my comments:-)
> >
> > I do not remember whether this URI is 'active' in the text, ie, whether
> it is an <a> element. If yes, than it must be a dereferenceable URI even
> for the FPWD; if it is only text, then it is not a show stopper,
> procedurally. That being said, I think it would be better to do it for
> real; I am not sure how long it will take for a next version of the model
> document (our focus will probably shift for a while) and implementers may
> already experiment with JSON-LD. Better provide something already now. (In
> which case the URI in the text should also be 'active'.)
> >
> >
> >> We also do not anywhere actually give the @context key in any of the
> JSON-LD examples, including the "complete" example in appendix C.
> >
> > That is fine. But we do say it is JSON-LD; if people really want to
> experiment with it, they will need the @context.
> >
> >> Even if we hadn't changed anything in the model or vocabulary, the
> decision to use more developer friendly keys in the JSON serialization
> would require a new context document.
> >
> > Yep. And whatever we do today is not cast in concrete.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> 2.  It would be beneficial to NOT create a new namespace URI and
> instead continue to use the /ns/oa# URI.  The community group baked this
> notion in from the beginning, such as not having a version or date in the
> URI on the very sensible recommendation of Dan Brickley and his experience
> with FOAF, amongst others.
> >
> > That works with me.
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> 3.  The discussion previously that resulted in the ontology being
> included in the context document was around the rule that /ns/ must only be
> used for ontology specifications.   Thus the workaround was to include both
> context and ontology in the same document.  As JSON-LD is increasingly
> popular, I'm sure that the issue as to context URIs could be solved in the
> general case as a recommended best practice.
> >>
> >> Is this something that the chairs+staff should raise more broadly
> within the W3C?  And to what extent do we need to solve it for FPWD or soon
> thereafter?
> >>
> >
> > Hm. I see your point. I can explore that, but there is a possibility
> around this: what about
> >
> > http://www.w3.org/annotation/context.jsonld
> >
> > as a URI. That can be created at any time.
> >
> > I will explore the issue, and may come back to you before you get back
> at your desk. In any case, if we go down that route, somebody should gives
> me the JSON-LD source, and I am happy to create that file and the FPWD
> should be updated accordingly. Does this work?
> >
> >
> >> 4.   Paolo and I, as community group chairs, should also confirm this
> approach with the CG that clearly has a stake in what happens at the
> namespace and context URIs.  I personally would be very surprised if
> there's any pushback, but it would be both polite and encourage continued
> engagement to do so.
> >
> > Please do. And another thing: I have not followed all the details, but
> has there been any change on the vocabulary itself (I do not think so, just
> checking...)? I mean: are the /ns/oa.* files up-to-date? In any case, the
> HTML page must be updated, referring to the current state; please provide
> Doug or I with a new version.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Ivan
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> Rob
> >>
> >> * Please assume this for everything I say, unless I specifically say
> "As chair, ..." :)
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Dec 3, 2014 at 8:12 AM, Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 03 Dec 2014, at 16:57 , Frederick Hirsch <w3c@fjhirsch.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Ivan
> >>>
> >>> Thanks for noting this.
> >>>
> >>> It seems to me (personally not as chair) that the right thing to do is
> the following
> >>>
> >>> 1. Keep oa as 'http://www.w3.org/ns/oa for the Web Annotation Data
> Model we are producing, as in the FPWD
> >>>
> >>> 2. Update the landing page appropriately
> >>>
> >>> 3. Add a clear warning to the Community Group  Open Annotation Data
> Model ‘community draft’ that there is an update underway in the Web
> Annotation WG, with a pointer to our new draft and home page
> >>>
> >>> It seems better to focus on the new work with the same URL as
> implementations are changing along with the specification.
> >>>
> >>> JSON-LD is new work so we don’t have a backward compatibility issue,
> right?
> >>
> >> Actually, there is a oa.jsonld file right now which is the @context AND
> the full vocabulary. In other words, it is a JSON-LD serialization of the
> full vocabulary. And what we need is a separate file for the @context only
> on, probably, a separate URI.
> >>
> >> Ivan
> >>
> >>>
> >>> regards, Frederick
> >>>
> >>> Frederick Hirsch, Nokia
> >>> Co-Chair W3C Web Annotation WG
> >>> @fjhirsch
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Dec 3, 2014, at 4:37 AM, Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Rob,
> >>>>
> >>>> one thing I realized, while looking at the FPWD text: the text refers
> to oa as 'http://www.w3.org/ns/oa. At this moment that URI exists and
> refers to the Community Group's output, with the vocabulary set up as an
> HTML+RDFa and other formats like turtle or json-ld.
> >>>>
> >>>> If we decide to keep that URI, we should update its landing page. It
> also means that this WG will override the various vocabularies that are
> already there. Do we want to do that? If so, we should check whether a new
> version should be put at those places while publishing the FPWD.
> >>>>
> >>>> We should also put up on the site a proper JSON-LD @context file; the
> current document has a phony URI for that purpose, and
> http://www.w3.org/ns/oa.jsonld has the full vocabulary (I am not sure
> whether we want that to be the @context file, it is probably too big for
> that purpose)
> >>>>
> >>>> Cheers
> >>>>
> >>>> Ivan
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ----
> >>>> Ivan Herman, W3C
> >>>> Digital Publishing Activity Lead
> >>>> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
> >>>> mobile: +31-641044153
> >>>> ORCID ID: http://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----
> >> Ivan Herman, W3C
> >> Digital Publishing Activity Lead
> >> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
> >> mobile: +31-641044153
> >> ORCID ID: http://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Rob Sanderson
> >> Technology Collaboration Facilitator
> >> Digital Library Systems and Services
> >> Stanford, CA 94305
> >
> >
> > ----
> > Ivan Herman, W3C
> > Digital Publishing Activity Lead
> > Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
> > mobile: +31-641044153
> > ORCID ID: http://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704
>
>
> ----
> Ivan Herman, W3C
> Digital Publishing Activity Lead
> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
> mobile: +31-641044153
> ORCID ID: http://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704
>
>
>
>
>


-- 
Rob Sanderson
Technology Collaboration Facilitator
Digital Library Systems and Services
Stanford, CA 94305