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Re: further baseline-related comments on deltav-10.1

From: Geoffrey M. Clemm <geoffrey.clemm@rational.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:35:59 -0400 (EDT)
Message-Id: <200010191335.JAA00505@tantalum.atria.com>
To: ietf-dav-versioning@w3.org

   From: Tim_Ellison@uk.ibm.com

   As currently specified, a baseline captures the targets of version
   selectors at, or below, the baselined collection. If there are
   unversioned collections at, or below, the collection being
   baselined, there is insufficient information to make the baseline
   useful for restoring that configuration.

It is true that the DAV:version-set is not sufficient information
(unless the baselined collection and all its sub-collections are
versioned) which means that a baseline implementation needs to save
additional information beyond the DAV:version-set (this was
intentional).  We specifically do not define how that information is
to be captured, in order to allow for the diverse ways of implementing

But one thing that does need to be fixed is in the section that
introduces the baseline concept, it says "the state of a baseline is
limited to be a set of versions".  This needs to be changed to say:
"the state of a baseline is limited to be a set of versions and their
relative names in the collection".

   Here's a simple scenario that shows the problem:


   7. Put the workspace root collection under baseline control
   specifying the previously-created baseline version

	BASELINE-CONTROL http://example.org/ws/ws1

        <baseline-control> <baseline>
        </baseline> </baseline-control>

   The hope would be that this would create a version selector at
   http://example.org/ws/ws1/file1 with target
   http://example.org/vers/vh1/v1, making the new workspace isomorphic
   to the workspace when it was baselined.

Yes, this is what it is required to do by the postconditions of the
BASELINE-CONTROL method.  Before draft 10.2, you had to do a
SET-TARGET as well, so this was only specified in the SET-TARGET

   However, this would only be possible if the baseline remembered
   more information than just the DAV:version-set; it would also need
   to remember that the collection had a "file1" internal member, and
   the associated target version is http://example.org/vers/vh1/v1.

Yes, but an implementation is free to capture this information in any
way it sees fit ... in collection versions, as a "name-map" table, or
whatever.  It's only requirement is that when time comes to restore
the baseline, it knows what the relative names are.

   While the above scenario shows that there's a hole in the story for
   the root collection of a baseline, the same problem exists for
   unversioned collections anywhere below the root.

It's a "hole" in a good way, i.e. it allows a client to get what it
wants done, while giving an implementation flexibility in how to
implement it.

   The main requirement is that a useful baseline is one that can be
   restored.  The issue to decide is what constitutes being

I believe this is fully defined in the post-conditions of
BASELINE-CONTROL and SET-TARGET (the two ways a baseline can be

   Two general approaches:

   (A) Only allow baselining of versioned collections. Effectively,
   "baseline" becomes an optional add-on to "versioned-collection",
   and baselines cannot be offered by a server that is not prepared to
   offer versioned collections.  This supports a fairly hi-fi notion
   of "restore". It is not perfectly fidelity, since non-versioned
   members are not captured; but this is compatible with the general
   philosophy for versioning collections.

That is certainly one reasonable implementation, but there's no reason
to "only allow" this implementation.

   (B) Allow baselining of arbitrary collections, but capture relevant
   namespace information along with the version selector.  For
   example, the DAV:version-set might instead contain (path, version)
   pairs: <version-set> <item> <href>file1</href>
   <href>http://example.org/vers/vh1/v1</href> </item> This would
   supports a weaker notion of "restore" for non-versioned collections
   with versioned members; it would allow these non-versioned
   collections to be re-created when the baseline is restored,
   although they would not be restored with any of their dead

This is certainly another reasonable implementation, but again, not
something we should require.

   Approach (B) feels more general, and allows baselines to be offered
   by a server that does not offer versioned collections (e.g.,
   something like CVS). Moreover, the additional information captured
   in the baseline should not represent a significant burden for
   servers planning to offer both baseline and versioned collections.

This information could be expensive to compute for certain
implementations.  I believe this places an unreasonable burden on
baseline implementors.  They should just be required to implement the
"restore" and "merge" operations.

   Other baseline-related problems with draft 10.1:

   section 15.10 CHECKOUT [p. 45-6]

   - Needs to specify the semantics of checking-out a baseline
   selector. In particular, what is the initial value of the
   DAV:version-set of the checked-out baseline selector. Presumably it
   contains the targets of all check-in version selectors at or below
   the collection to which the baseline selector is attached.

Actually, I think we should just leave this unspecified.  Some
implementations will want to defer computing the DAV:version-set until
the CHECKIN operation, while others will use the DAV:version-set to
dynamically track the current targets.  Requiring one way or the other
would be a problem for one implementation or the other.  A client that
wants this information can either look at the DAV:checked-out
baseline, or do a PROPFIND for DAV:target, so there is no need for
this information to be retrieved from the checked out version

   It also needs to be specified whether the DAV:version-set property
   of a checked-out baseline selector is updated live as the baselined
   collection is modified; i.e., can I query the DAV:version-set
   property of a checked-out baseline selector at any time to discover
   a perfectly accurate picture of the baseline collection?

See above.

   - Needs to specify the semantics of checking-out a baseline
   version. It's not clear that that this is a particularly useful
   thing to do. Since the baseline version is divorced from the
   baseline selector, there wouldn't been to be any way to affect its
   DAV:version-set between checkout and check-in.

Yes, checking-out a baseline version makes no sense, for the reason
you give.  It would be worth making this specific.  In particular, I
propose we add a DAV:collection property for a baseline selector, to
make it clear that a baseline selector tracks the targets of a
particular collection.

   section 15.11 CHECKIN [p. 45-6]

   - Needs to specify the semantics of checking-in a checked-out
   baseline selector.

Good grief!  That got lost when we replaced "MKBASELINE" with CHECKIN
of a baseline selector.  Thanks for catching that!

   In particular, what is the value of the DAV:version-set of the
   newly created baseline version,

the DAV:target values of all version selectors that are members of the
DAV:collection of the checked out version selector

   and how does it relate to the value of that property on the
   baseline selector,


   and the configuration of the baselined collection, at check-in

I'm not sure what you mean by "configuration of the baselined
collection" but the answer probably is "it is the DAV:target values of
all version selectors that are members of the baselined collection".

   What happens to version selectors below the baselined collection
   that are currently checked-out?  They should eithe be ignored, or
   the operation should fail in their presence.

It fails.

   What happens to non-versioned resources below the baselined
   collection? They should be ignored when capturing the baseline.

Yes, ignored.

   - Needs to specify the semantics of checking-in a baseline working

We will make clear in CHECKOUT that you cannot create a baseline
working resource (i.e. you can only have checked out baseline
selectors that are associated with a baselined collection).

Outstanding review, Tim!  Thanks!

Received on Thursday, 19 October 2000 09:36:33 UTC

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